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Help me save my lyterial anthais

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  • Help me save my lyterial anthais

    Hey guys i noticed one of my female anthias has i think you call it Popeye?

    anyway is there anything i can do? one evey is swollen, not too bad, but more than the other eye. the other eye that is not effected is normal (compared to the other female anthias).

    its just the one eye is swollen, is there anything i can do?

    will it result in death? or blindness in that one eye?


    275 Gallon Envision Acrylics Tank, 70 gallon sump, BK 300 internal, Zeovit, 5 sequence darts (1 on a oceansmotions 4-way), medusa dual controller, 2 ebo jaer 250w heaters, 1/2 hp JBJ comercial chiller, 4 RO IIIs w/14k hamilitons, 4 VHOs super actinic, deltec pf500 Ca Rx, 3 reef ceramic pillar, and 1 reef ceramic mini-reef, 5 ceramic closed loop intake screen covers, with 50ish pounds of LR

  • #2
    Greetings All !

    Originally posted by nbd13
    ... its just the one eye is swollen ...
    Sorry to hear about the injury.

    Given that we're talking about only one eye ...

    The original cause was problably a physical, as opposded to pathenogenic, injury to the eye. The swelling you see is probably the result of a secondary bacterial infection.

    Originally posted by nbd13
    ... is there anything i can do?
    Definitely ... along three general pathways:

    1. Water Quality
    2. Nutrition
    3. Treatment

    Water Quality
    While I presume there's nothing out of balance with the water parameters, it might be worth a check (if you haven't already). Poor water quality can stress the specimen, and assist the growth/spread of any infection. Everyone whats to rush into treatment ... cover this basic aspect first. Apologies if that comes across as condescending ... you know your stuff Nick ... just making sure.

    Given that the original cause was probably not pathenogenic, boosting the immune system of the specimen is a good next step. If the specimen is no longer accepting frozen foods, switch to live foods. If you're not already adding things like selcon and vitamins (... pick your favorite brand ...) then you might consider it. Soaking these products onto/into frozen food is a good delivery system. If the specimen is no longer accepting frozen foods, soaking live brine shrimp in selcon for 20 minutes prior to feeding delivers the selcon, and keeps the specimen eating. Live blood worms are another option that's worked for me with Anthias. While much over-hyped and poorly researched, there is some evidence that garlic extract (... allomycin ... sp?) has anti-bacterial qualities, although the marketing of garlic extract as an anti-parasitic leaves me ROTFL ... no clinical evidence whatsoever.

    The point being ... if the infection isn't too bad, there's a reasonable chance that good water quality and enriched nutrition will take care of the infection without having to start adding anti-microbials into your system.

    If the cause was truly a case of popeye, I would expect that both eyes would be distended. We're probably talking about as secondary, external bacterial infection. Antibacterials mixed into frozen foods is a possibility, as is freshwater dipping to attack to the bacteria colony. Both tactics carry risks.

    Also, be sure you're looking at a bacterial phenomenon. The other possibilities include flukes and digenic trematodes. These have different treatments.

    Some quick search results ... FWIW ...

    The term 'Popeye', also called exophthalmos or exophthalmia, more accurately describes a symptom than an actual disease. Popeye is characterized by one or both eyes bulging or protruding from the eye socket, appearing to have excess air or fluid trapped inside. Early in the condition, vision may or may not be impaired, appetite is usually not affected and the fish appears and behaves normal. Popeye may last from several days to weeks.

    No real cause of this normally non-contagious condition has been determined, but a number of factors may give rise to the problem. Injury to the eye from netting, bullying by other fish or abrasion from hard objects are possible causes. Popeye may also be a symptom of a secondary infection or internal bacterial, viral or fungal infection.

    Treatment outcomes are not consistant. Treatment should be started at the onset of symptoms. Along with treating the fish with Penicillin or Neomycin, feeding frozen foods soaked in Tetracycline may help. Good results are often seen from with Eye Fungex. Treatment may or may not be effective and a number of possible outcomes may result. Certainly the most favorable outcome is that the eye returns to its normal appearance and function. Conversely, partial or complete blindness may occur, the affected eye may become cloudy, rupture and disappear. None of these situations is always fatal, but when the result is total blindness, the fish's chances of survival are slim, at best. Some hobbyists have been known to hand feed their blind fish for years.

    Extracted From:
    Disease Descriptions and Recommended Treatments

    I disagree with the Tetracycline suggestion as effective ... Spectrogram would be much better. Hopefully other will chime in with better anti-bacterial drug recommendations and experiences.

    Popeye in Saltwater Fish
    A basic, mainstream discussion of popeye with the standard recommendations. Good background ... maybe too generalized.

    This is a symptom, not a disease. It is usually caused by swelling behind the eye (or in the eye). The swelling may be caused by many factors but is most commonly caused by bacteria.
    If unilateral (only one side) the cause may be mechanical injury. Time only may effect a cure. It is difficult to treat, but the most effective procedure seems to be a good environment, and medicated food. Start with flakes "D" and "A" in conjunction, then feed flake "B", and go on to flake "C" if needed. Erythromycin or Chloramphenicol may also be effective.
    Extracted From:
    Fish Disease Handout
    Couldn't find what is meant be flakes ABCD ... but I'm betting some form of medicated food regiment. Chloramphenicol can be nasty stuff, not only because it's most effective when injected (Naga 2000) ... but because it is potentially quite hazardous. Read up on it before you use it ... please. Erythromycin is palatable and effective when mixed in with frozen foods, but accumulation in your system may disrupt bacteria populations.

    looks like you fish has a mild case of popeye. Is the cornea also cloudy?
    So any idea what your water paramters are. I see you did some seriou cleaning. I'm wondering if you caused your tank to cycle.
    So you say all tank parameters are good, can you check on them?
    Often times the stress of you having your hands in the tank, remodeling rocks work, and cleanin will stress the fish enuf to make this happen. Add to it maybe suspect water quality and you have popeye.
    An alterantive of course is that the banggai dashed into some rockwork and damaged his eye escaping your hands.
    Okay what to do.
    First tell me what you water parameters are, maybe have some new SW ready to do a decent water exchange.
    Is the fish still eating? if so feed him quality meaty foods enriched w/ selcon, vitamins.
    If this doesn't clear up after the water change let consider antibiotic treatments w/ a furan or minocycline(SW MII) -type antibiotic
    I look forward to your response

    Dr. Frank Marini

    Extracted From:
    RC Thread
    I'm a serious Dr. Marini fan ... the problem with furan is that it's difficult to administer orally. We're talking quarantine tank.

    Good Luck!

    JMO ... HTH

    "When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."
    Hunter S. Thompson


    • #3
      Thanks for your help as always great info.

      i tested water and its fine.

      you know now that you mention it, i do see a bruise i think. its purple and alittle swollen like you said. the other observation i made was the eye was not cloudy like the other common popeye sign. so i am thinking along your lines that it was an injury. while i am unsure if it is infected, i do know it is bruised.

      it is still eating well, although it does hide most of the day, it eats when i feed the tank ( 2 times, noon, and 6ish). so i am hopefull that it will take care of its self.

      again thanks for the info. any other tips or trival knowledge which i love.

      275 Gallon Envision Acrylics Tank, 70 gallon sump, BK 300 internal, Zeovit, 5 sequence darts (1 on a oceansmotions 4-way), medusa dual controller, 2 ebo jaer 250w heaters, 1/2 hp JBJ comercial chiller, 4 RO IIIs w/14k hamilitons, 4 VHOs super actinic, deltec pf500 Ca Rx, 3 reef ceramic pillar, and 1 reef ceramic mini-reef, 5 ceramic closed loop intake screen covers, with 50ish pounds of LR