New Zeo User

[Marc Daniels]

After following Paul's (prodman) thread on another site, I decided to make the plunge and ordered the starter kit from Greg a few days ago.

Tank params;
300g TruVu
Sump Holds 19 +/- gallons
Salinity 1.025 (from refractometer)
Temp (fluctuates from 70-81 daily)
Dkh 7
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 0
Calcium 400
pH (daily swing 8.05 - 8.2)
Water is RO/DI on an auto top off and the level in the tank is constant.
I do not run a Calcium reactor, and I do not dose. I am doing bimonthly water changes with RO/DI and Instant Ocean.

I figure based upon the 20% rule that I would dose for 240g + the 19g in the sump for 269g total.

Any advice/direction before I start dosing in a few days?

Marc

[Marc Daniels]

Oh ,before I get asked, my main reason for trying Zeo is for overall color improvement.

Marc

[Aged Salt]

Hi Marc, & welcome to ZEOvit.com A question or two,--have you used KW in this tank? How old is the tank & LR?. The parameters for using ZEOvit method are as follows--Ca>400/Mg>1250/KH-6-8dKH/saslinity 1.023-25. These should be stable, especially the KH. Asuming no KW has been driped in this system, I recommend the following:
1)dose 1 ltr. carbon, passively in your sump in a filter sock. Knead this bag 3x's/wk & exchange monthly.
2)dose 2 1/2 ltrs zeolites in a filter at a flow rate of ~250gph. Be careful not to exceed this gph. Pump-clean the stones 1-2 x's/day, & cycle them on & off at 3hr. intervals. A simple "peg" timer is perfect for this. Exchange the zeolites every 6wks.
3)dose Bak/Food7 6 drops each daily for the 1st 2wks., then 2x's/wk. Dose these near your filter pump & turn off your skimmer for 60min after dosing these.
4)dose .25ml Start2 2x's/day. It is not necessary to turn off the skimmer when just dosing Start2.
5)dose AAHC 5 drops daily;dose C-V 10 drops daily--these can be dosed into the display area. PIF/Fe/M-E, etc. can be started later. Plz. ask any questions Bob

[mesocosm]

Greetings All !


Marc Daniels ...

[Marc Daniels]

Thanks for the welcome.

Bob, I'm assuming that KW is Kalkwasser...correct? If so then no, I have never dosed it in this tank. I do use SeaChem Superbuffer-dkh in my RO/DI makeup water.

The tank has been setup since February of this year, so 8 months give or take. I had a 135g setup for several years that 50% of the liverock came from. The other 50% came from my an area LFS. 75%-80% of the sand is new Caribsea, with the remainder taken from the old 135g. I rinsed the old sand to get as much of the fine silt out as I could, I rinsed with water out of the 135g, not fresh water. I've never (knock/wood) had an algae problems and have always been religious about water changes...and NOT overfeeding. I did rinse the liverock like crazy to get as much crud out before placing it into the new tank, but I did not cook it.

I do very little dosing, probably because the tank is not stocked very heavily, and get most of what I need from regular bimonthly water changes in the 15% range. I also change approx. 1/3l of carbon bi monthly as well.
Marc

[nyfireman3097]

Hey Marc welcome to the site im sure you will love the improvements

[Diesel3443]

Welcome Marc. I wish my tank could stay stable from bimonthly water changes.

[Marc Daniels]

Update.....a correction. I have a few new test kits, so I went ahead and tested this evening with them. Everything tested about normal except for calcium, it came out at 280. I borrowed a buddies test kit, and again it came out low in the upper 200's. Tried the old kit, which has a use by date of 1/2006, and it came out at 400. Looks like I got a bogus kit, and my calcium may have been depressed for several months. Could explain why stuff slowly turned brown, and/or sort of washed out.

Marc

[Marc Daniels]

I have a calcium reactor unit, I just have not added it to the tank yet. Should I add it before going Zeo, after, same time.........?

Marc

[Aged Salt]

Hi Marc, I'd add it now, rectify the Ca level & tweak the CR so that the parameters are inline with those given above & stable before beginning ZEOvit. Bob

[GTR]

While corals can obviously live in less than ideal conditions I'd assume your CA level has slowly drifted downward, That's given them a little time to adapt but at the same time they might be in a weakened state of health.
As Bob has said, I'd slowly get your parimeters back in line with natural seawater levels before starting ZEOvit. I might personally even want to allow a couple weeks to pass with these new stable conditions before starting.
You will be making changes to the nutrient levels once you begin ZEO and it might be best to eliminate these other issues first. These other issues are IMO why some users have not been satisfied with the results when in fact there were underlying problems from the start.

Just my take...

SteveU

[Marc Daniels]

SteveU-

That's sort of what I noticed in seveal threads across the boards. People were trying Zeo as if it were some miracle cure for systems that were way out of whack. Then when the miracle didn't happen they bad mouthed the product. Zeo certainly is going to take some patience and work, and a lot of people just won't (or can't) take the time required to do regular testing in order to tweak their dosing. Also, good testing equipment/kits are expensive. It's funny how people will spend thousands of dollars on livestock but balk at paying $50 for a quality Lamotte kit, or $150 for a Hanna digital colorimeter. I'll get everything dialed in for a few weeks before starting Zeo on my 300.

I do have a 100g prop tank w/ sump.. Bob, if you could spare a couple minutes I would apprciate some dosing direction on this tank. MAybe I'll start Zeo out there and then bring it into the 300g later. These are the params;
1. 155g Gross water volume
2. 110g Net water volume
3. No. Are you using a CaCO2 reactor or other technique
4. No. Are you using a PO4 reactor (how long, how long ago, etc.)
5. No. Are you using Ozone
6. No. Are you using UV
7. ASM G2 (rated for 200g)
8. P04 .02 mg/l NO3 non detected
9. Ca 380, Alk 7 dkh, Mg no test kit
10. What filtration method do you use (Chaeto loaded refugium, 1" sandbed, 30lbs live rock)
11. Type of light (2 x 250w halides at 10K, 7 months old)
12. What corals do you keep (SPS, some LPS around the perimeter)
13. Tissue color (some tissue is a light tan, others are a dark brown. The tips are colored. Some of them have great color, while others do not.)
14. How long has the tank been running (7 months)
15. Why do you want to use the ZEOvit system (increased color, and maybe growth)
16. Any supplemental dosing (regular water changes, 1 tsp Kalk added via the slurry method approx. 2hr after lights out.)
17. Live rock (20lbs in sump, 7 months old)
18. Any present problems
19. Problem description (tissue loss tips, tissue loss base, diatom bloom, algae, etc.)
20. What test kit do you use (6 months old +/-, SeaChem and Aquarium Systems test kits)
22. Other water parameters and water stability (salinity 1.025, temp 78f, all water is RO/DI with a TDS of 0. I do use SuperBuffer dkh on the makeup water.

The only fish in the system is a 4" Masked Rabbit. I do not feed the tank at all. He is fat and happy on the litle Chaeto that makes it into the main area. Even though I use RO/Di, and the tank is not being fed, I have a lush and fast growing large amout of chaeto on the refugium. The refugium is not directly lit, but gets light from the halides since it is along side the tanks. I wouldn't expect this kind of macro growth without an apparent nutrient source. No other alage are present.

Marc

[Aged Salt]

Marc, this alternative trial is fine, although, be sure to obtain a Mg test kit As the nutrients eventually are lowered, the chaeto may die-off. For a 110g net vol.:
1)dose 1 Cup carbon
2)dose 1 ltr zeolite with the filter flow rate of 100gph. Exchange the stones every 6wks.
3)dose 3 drops Bak/Food7 daily for 1wk, then 3 drops each 2x's/wk.
4)dose 5 drops Start2 2x's/day.
5)dose 2-3 drops AAHC daily; C-V 6 drops daily.

Bob

[Marc Daniels]

Bob...thanks. Just picked up the required test kits. I went ahead and bought all new kits so I could double check numbrs.


Anyone know the best places to pick up the Hanna digital equipment?

Marc

[mesocosm]

Greetings All !

It's funny how people will spend thousands of dollars on livestock but balk at paying $50 for a quality Lamotte kit, or $150 for a Hanna digital colorimeter.

Welcome to the Desert of the Real ... I confront this reality every day at work ... go figure.

I do have a 100g prop tank w/ sump... Chaeto loaded refugium, 1" sandbed, 30lbs live rock ... SPS, some LPS around the perimeter ... some tissue is a light tan, others are a dark brown. The tips are colored. Some of them have great color, while others do not ... 7 months ... Why do you want to use the ZEOvit system (increased color, and maybe growth) ... Regular water changes, 1 tsp Kalk added via the slurry method approx. 2hr after lights out.)

It appears that your prop system could respond quite nicely to ZEOvit.

"Chaeto loaded refugium ...". My experience with ZEOvit and macroalgae has been somewhat different than other users, perhaps because my system was also a dedicated prop system. I found that the more fleshy macros ... Chaetomorpha, Enteromorpha, and Gracillaria ... actually responded quite nicely to the oligotropic environment that was produced. They also appeared to react well to the Fe additive. Nutrients to feed them was not a problem as I was continually adding new pieces from the wholesalers ... your situation may be different. You might consider significantly cutting back on the mass of the Chaetomorpha (70% - 80% total over the first two weeks of ZEOvit), if you want it to have a better chance for long-term survival as the nutrient levels fall.

"... Kalk added ...". You may experience a slightly extended timeframe for PO4 levels to finally drop.

"... 1" sandbed ... the tank is not being fed ...". Depending on your feeding strategy, you may wish to consider stirring your sand bed after the first 2 week of ZEOvit. Both the SPS and LPS specimens you mentioned ... as well as the bacterioplankton generated from the ZEOvit system ... might enjoy (benefit from) the suspended POM in the water column. Stirring the bed might also accelerate the export of any organic reservoir which might be present.

Your plans ... and especially your attitude regarding patience ... sound most excellent. Pictures ... we WANT pictures ...


JMO ... HTH