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  • Another hapless newbie

    Hello all,

    I'm sold. The results can't be ignored, so my new tank will be set up with ZEOvit from the beginning. My question is about the tank cycle.
    Should I by following the regular guide instructions during my start up phase? While the tank is cycling (live rock only), what can I expect from ZEOvit?
    Would a shallow sand bad be as horrible using ZEOvit from the beginning?
    Total water volume including sump and rock should be about 50 gallons, if that makes a difference.

    Thanks,

    Garrick

    p.s. Please don't tell anyone on RC I posted here. I'm hiding!

  • #2
    welcome to Z.com
    please answer this questions, so we know more about your system,

    Comment


    • #3
      No problem. I should have filled this out earlier, but I thought I could slide by with a more general question.

      1. Gross water volume of your complete system (incl. sump etc.) 70 gallons
      2. Net water volume (incl. sump etc.) ~50 gallons (I'm not sure how much rock I'll be starting with, recommendations are welcome.
      3. Are you using a CaCO2 reactor or other technique - 2 part dosing, I think. I will switch to a reactor if I can't keep the levels steady.
      4. Are you using a PO4 reactor (how long, how long ago, etc.) - no plan to
      5. Are you using Ozone - no
      6. Are you using UV - no
      7. What skimmer are you using (type, rated water volume) - venturi- 120 rated gallons
      8. What are your actual PO4 and NO3 levels - The tank is empty. No measurable PO4 or NO3. I'd like it to stay that way after adding water.
      9. What are your actual Ca, Alk and Mg levels - I'm going to have to leave this blank, too.
      10. What filtration method do you use (refugium, DSB, Miracle Mud, etc.) - Live rock and water movement. I like running a refugium on my 20 gallon, but have no specific plans to run one on this tank.
      11. Type of light (Watt, color temp, how old, etc.) - 2 250 watt 10k
      12. What corals do you keep - planned SPS and Zoanthid
      13. Tissue color (light or dark)
      14. How long has the tank been running - minus 2 weeks and counting
      15. Why do you want to use the ZEOvit system - This is a good question. First, pictures of ZEOvit tanks are incredible. Also, I like the scheduled approach. Being able to plan maintenance by a definite, thought out plan appeals to me. I'm also a technology junkie, and probably like the elitist/outcast feelings the product seems to generate. Please don't take that last part as an insult. This board is extremely friendly, I don't want to hack anyone off on my second post.
      16. Any supplemental dosing (type, amount, why, etc.) - planned 2 part calcium
      17. Live rock (how much, how old, etc.) - open to suggestions
      18. Any present problems - impatience
      19. Problem description (tissue loss tips, tissue loss base, diatom bloom, algae, etc.) - in my 20 gallon, my growth is not impressive for stony corals. I'd like to try something new on the new tank
      20. What test kit do you use (how old, recently switched, etc.) - Salifert
      21. Present dosing, amounts and intervals (ZEOvit, ZEObak, ZEOfood, ZEOstart, ZEOspur2, etc.) - I'm planning the basic 4 at first, dosing suggestions would be appreciated
      22. Other water parameters and water stability (salinity, temp, etc.) - NA

      Thank you for your response. I'm really looking forward to trying this out.

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi Garrick
        Fish eat poop....tastes just like chicken.

        Comment


        • #5
          Hi Garrick and welcome.

          First thing we need to do is establish your "net water volume". 70 gallon display + 50 gallon sump (guessing half filled?) = 95 gallons. Then we have to subtract the water displacement from the rock and/or sand. I've heard to take away 20% for a safe number so this would take us to around 75 gallons. So for now we will assume that is your net volume.

          You can start of with 3/4 of a liter of zeovit, in a filter with approx 75 gph (50-100gph is workable though), stir daily. Replace media at 4 weeks, then every 6-7 weeks thereafter.
          In the cycling stage, dose 3 ml's of zeostart daily. It's best to split this into multiple daily dosages (ie 1.5ml's twice daily) for the first 3 days. After this you can lower dosages to .75 ml's daily)

          Dose zeobac and zeofood at 1-2 drops daily for first two weeks, then 2 times a week.
          Use 3/4 cups of carbon passively in your sump and change it monthly.

          You can start out with the basic 4 like you mentioned and if you try any other product during this initial time let it be the Amino Acids. If you decide to try the other elements peope use I suggest waiting until your tank is established and you can "see" what zeovit is doing for each coral. At that point you can decide what/if you need any other supplements.

          It's a good idea to use a ca reactor if possible. I think you can maintain your levels with a two part solution but those also contain other trace elements which may or may not be feeding algae or prohibiting corals from "coloring up". that being said, many people do use a 2 part solution and they seem to be satisfied with the results that both that and zeovit provide.

          Comment


          • #6
            Thank you very much. I'm afraid I was unclear on the volume and made a guess.
            The main tank is a standard 55 gallon with a 10-15 gallon sump area, taking into account an about half-full sump. Or half-empty, depending on your point of view. I'll do the math this time. This gives me 65 gallons - 20% = 52 gallons. I should be able to go with half a liter of ZEOvit, if I'm not completely off.
            Is ZEOstart really needed/recommended in a cycling tank? I thought it was intended to boost the bacterial growth, but shouldn't slightly stinky live rock do the same thing?
            I witnessed a severe freak-out over ZEOstart on another board. Rationally, logically, I know it has been reformulated. I may have been shoved into paranoia over it.
            Again, I'm new. I read the guide. I'm just trying to clarify some things by asking people who know.

            Thanks,

            Garrick

            Comment


            • #7
              So, at about 52 gallons my dosage would be 1/2 the 100 gallon standard outlined in the guide.
              Yesterday I ordered my ZEO kit. I opted to try the Start2. I also picked up an extra liter of ZEOliths, to confirm my dedication to the system.
              Will running ZEOvit from the beginning, with uncured live rock going in at the same time, speed up the cycle of the tank?
              While I will admit to some impatience to get my SPS corals moved over to the new tank, I'm also wondering if ZEOvit will help in keeping the live rock die-off to a minimum in the new tank.
              Also, how long should I run the reactor with the 3 hours on 3 hours off pattern?

              Please forgive my newbiosity.

              Thanks,

              Garrick

              Comment


              • #8
                Hi Garrick, welcome to the ZEOvit method it is fantastic for our corals

                Yes, you will reduce your zeolite dose to 1/2ltr. at 50gph flow through your zeo-filter. Be as close as possible to the 50gph mark. Also your carbon dosage is 1/2 Cup, kneaded 3x's/wk, placed passively in a mesh-bag & exchanged monthly. As Madison has already given zeo-dosages which will be appropriate for the first cycle on ZEOvit. It is imperative to measure exactly your parameters, as these must be within range of NSW, eg. Ca>400/Mg> 1250/KH-7-8, or one can impact our corals negatively. Plz. ask questions as you have them. Bob
                Last edited by Aged Salt; 06-18-2005, 09:41 AM.
                "There might be something to this ZEOvit"

                Comment


                • #9
                  Thank you very much!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hello again, everyone.
                    The tank has been set up for a little over a month now. I've added the few survivors from the old tank (concrete sealant fumes disaster while we were prepping the floor for the new tank) as well as some frags from local sources.
                    I've been religiously dosing 1 drop of bak and 1 drop of food 2 times a day, along with .3 ml of Start2. The stones are agitated twice a day and the reactor is running on the recommended 3 hours on/3 hours off schedule. I've been changing 5 gallons (10%) a week and last weekend did a larger water change of about 20 gallons over 3 days.
                    I have never, ever fed the tank.
                    My phosphates are unreadible on a Salifert test kit, but my Nitrates are still over 30pm. They won't budge.
                    I've got three clams (including a rather large squamosa) and I've even added macro algae to the sump, using a shop light to convert it into a refugium. No luck.
                    Should I change my dosage? Do something I'm missing?
                    My corals are starting to brown out. They aren't showing signs of distress, but I'm not holding up as well.
                    What do I do?
                    I've got a happy new bottle of Spur but I'm waiting for my Nitrates to vanish before I can use it.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Should I just up the volume on water changes?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hi Garrick, the 10% water changes will help if your product water is low-P04--plz. check this for TDS, P04's & N03's. Is your nitrate test-kit over 1 y/o? I'd recommend the removal of the macro-algae & sand bed, just use it for water volume[dilution] Is your skimmer efficient? What type do you have?. Your N03's may well be a reflection of nutrients sequestered in your LR/LS that is leaking back into your waters. In time this will be depleted, so patience & good tank husbandry will be needed.. For the time-period[6wks now] I recommend changing your regimen:
                        1)dose 3/4 cup carbon--knead this 3x's/wk
                        2)dose 3/4 ltr. zeolites & increase the flow rate slightly to ~ 75gph. If you are not using a zeo-filter, consider this seriously for your system.
                        3)dose Bak/Food 2 drops every other day for 2 wks, then, 2 drops each 2x's/wk. Turn off your skimmer for 60 min after dosing Bak/Food. Dose these near the zeo-filter pump. Dose these when the filter is "on"
                        4)dose Start2 .1ml 2x's/day daily. It is not necessary to turn off your skimmer when just dosing Start2
                        5)for coral color--dose AAHC 2 drops daily; dose PIF 2 drops 3x's/wk. Garrick, plz. post up your impressions in 2 wks, thnx. Bob
                        "There might be something to this ZEOvit"

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Garrick, are you changing your stones every 6 weeks? Also after the first change out you should only dose bac and food every other day for the first 2 weeks then 2X weekly until the next change out. Do this after all changeouts.. Also use a few of the old stones to help seed the new. Dose start at .1ml 2x daily. Also its very important that you check all water params and report them back as well.. Dosing schedules mean nothing if your params are not inline and also stable.. Give me CA, ALK, Mg, salinity, PH...

                          Jeff

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Thank you both for the help. I'll adjust the dosage to come in line with your recommendations and add more stones. I changed the first set after 1 month, leaving a few in the reactor.
                            Hopefully, reducing the dosing will help.
                            I'll run a fresh set of tests when I get home this evening and post the results.
                            Thanks again,

                            Garrick

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